Might move to Croatia - Cost of homes???

[mambo]

I don't care if people want to make a profit on real estate, that is up to them. What I do care about is the pure greed of some real estate agents/developers.

They will ruin an area and when the tourists leave they will also leave and the only thing that remains is a devastated coastline.

Sure, the Croatians love driving the prices up, I would too if I had a home, but problem is also that many foreigners arrive here, have no clue about the real value and simply pay anything that is requested.
That sounds like very logic to everyone doesn't it ?

Well, the result is something like 'holiday villages', some people in the summer, but completely deserted in the wintertime. Here in Istria we have a perfect example how it should not be, it is called Cervar. This town was built some 15 to 20 years ago, all apartments sold to foreigners and people who don't live in this region.
Result ?
All year long, so summer and winter, all supermarkets closed, almost every restaurant is closed, no maintenance is being done, because also in the summertime the place is now also empty, most people only come 2 weeks a year, rest of the time they are not there. For a supermarket, shop or restaurant economically not feasable.

We call Cervar 'Ghostcity' and this is not the only one on the coast. Inland we see the same thing happening, local people moving out, foreigners with money coming in, changing the landscape forever.

And in the end we will end up like Pula or like many tourist places around the world (take Spain for instance). Once the thrill is gone, the tourists move on and the country is left with nothing. Some people made a load of money real fast, they are happy, but don't ever tell me that they care about what is going on.


Why am I looking for land ?

Because I live here and instead of driving 35 km to get to work and 35 back I want to be a bit closer. Unfortunately, due to the rediculous prices of real estate nothing normal can be bought, so only option is to build it myself. Will save me 75 % of the cost if I would buy it on the market. That is why I am looking for land.
But as I said before, the locals have seen the light as well. For sure it is not the last piece of land available, but if a foreigner shows up they know that they can try a rediculous price, perhaps the guy will pay. A local would never pay that price, since a local knows the real value. So they give it a try and they will refuse to sell for lower, they think that the foreigner is so desperate that eventually he will pay.
Strange logic, but that is the way it goes overhere.

[davidzg]

croam said:

so your pissed off that the people selling the property to you are making out and its eating into your "potential" profit making scheme. Hmmmmnnnn.... I agree you can't compare croatia to other places. If you want investment property...then Buy it knowing you will have to sit on it for 5-10 years to sell it at a profit. Buying and then renting out is going to be a big pain in the ass and not worthwhile. If you want to invest in realestate do it the right way. Buy low, sell high. And yeah, get your croatian friends to do it. Or be a business man and tell them how its going to be. That situation with the lady and kid in the car getting it for half the price?? if he was willing to take that lower price from her he'll take it from you. Its pure logic. Offer him cash or wire transfer right away...or you walk. Big deal. Like he's got the last piece of land. Get a friend to buy it. And live in it. You wanted to cash in on the realestate goldmine there? Should have bought during the war.

Croam calm down dude, you make some good points, but you seem angry. Croatian real estate is not like more advance countries.
In England people will know what the standard price is in a certain area, then you will add or take away a little depending on the quality of the property. Here this is all still new, so people guess and ask insane prices.

The biggest problem is (in my opinion) that these highly over inflated prices) pose more of a problem for the locals than foreigners; they actually price locals out of their country. Can you imagine earning 3000 kunas a month (like many do), and having a small child to feed and not being able to find a house in your area for less than 150,000 euros.

[mambo]

David,

It is not even buying a house, that part is for most Croatians out of the question. If you didn't own it a long time ago, there is no way that you will be able to afford it now.

But also the rent goes up drastically. Owners of apartments don't accept 200 euro/month or less, because the tourists will pay more (so they think). They will gladly leave the apartment empty all year long to get some money during the summer.
In some cases people are told they can rent from September until May, then they have to move. And in the off-season they still have to pay 250 euro/month.

I know several cases like this, where the rent is 2000 Kuna (excl gas, water, electricity) and the salary is 3500 Kuna per month. The only way to solve the problem is that they keep moving around or family starts living together again to pay the rent.

This is the black side of the housing market, a side no tourists or developer cares about.

When the market implodes, which will happen sooner or later, they will leave and don't care about 'who has to clean up the mess'.

I have seen it happening in Spain, I have seen it in the Caribbean and I have even seen it in Italy !
In Vicenza Americans were able to completely turn the rental market upside down in 2 weeks time, it never recovered ! That attitude makes me angry. I am sorry.

[davidzg]

mambo said:

David,

It is not even buying a house, that part is for most Croatians out of the question. If you didn't own it a long time ago, there is no way that you will be able to afford it now.

But also the rent goes up drastically. Owners of apartments don't accept 200 euro/month or less, because the tourists will pay more (so they think). They will gladly leave the apartment empty all year long to get some money during the summer.
In some cases people are told they can rent from September until May, then they have to move. And in the off-season they still have to pay 250 euro/month.

I know several cases like this, where the rent is 2000 Kuna (excl gas, water, electricity) and the salary is 3500 Kuna per month. The only way to solve the problem is that they keep moving around or family starts living together again to pay the rent.

This is the black side of the housing market, a side no tourists or developer cares about.

When the market implodes, which will happen sooner or later, they will leave and don't care about 'who has to clean up the mess'.

I have seen it happening in Spain, I have seen it in the Caribbean and I have even seen it in Italy !
In Vicenza Americans were able to completely turn the rental market upside down in 2 weeks time, it never recovered ! That attitude makes me angry. I am sorry.

I know what you mean I was working on that army base in Vicenza for 2 months earlier in the year. I'm not sure you can blame the Americans, they would prefer to pay less, and it’s the local property owners. The amazing thing is property in Verona was cheaper and it’s much more beautiful and an easy drive. My boss is based there full time.
This is not related but I love it there, there was still snow in Zagreb and there it was nearly 30 degrees and sunny and I don't think it's any further south.

Even in kosovo, to rent a small apartment close to the us base is 450 euros a month to rent the same apartment 40 miles away is 150 euros a month.

I guess we should just accept the laws of supply and demand despite our misgivings.

[mambo]

I lived in Vicenza for four years and saw the Americans coming (I worked with them on Dal Molin). First they stayed in hotels, then moved to apartments.
Problem was that they were allowed to spend 70 USD per person per day for housing, so what happened ?
They told the real estate people that they could spend 2100 USD per month and that they did not care if it was necessary or not. As long as telephone cost, heating, electricity and sometimes even food was put on the bill it was fine with them. What they did not spend of the 70 USD did not come into their pockets, so not spending it meant it was gone.

At the time an apartment did about 250 euro/month..................in 2 weeks time that price jumped to 2100 USD per month. Strange isn't it ?

Obviously the Italians and other non-Americans were not so happy, since they could not afford these prices.
Now, most of the Americans of 5 ATAF are gone, the apartment market is destroyed and the Italians still cannot get an apartment for a decent price. That is the price a city has to pay when fools come into town.

[davidzg]

Well the renters will be happy soon, because that base is going to increase its size as lots of the german bases are closing down.

Won't help the locals though.

[croam]

"That is the price a city has to pay when fools come into town."

welcome to the new "ism" called capitalism.

in capitalism, as in nature, not everyone is supposed to make it. and we will all dies sooner or later.

i guess I'm a social darwinist. better than being stuck in some communist system.

[midge]

But in nature everyone is given a chance (more or less). Can't say the same for capitalism.

[croam]

good point.