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Post by kesterj on Aug 9, 2010 19:31:40 GMT 1
Anna wrote;
pinkfloyd, I think by some of the responses you'll see that the forum and the main site are reasonably separate in terms of who uses what and for who. I'm sure a lot of the regular contributors to the forum probably never look at the main site, and have no need to.
Er, I confess to being guilty. I honestly do not know what the "main site" is, and most certainly, to the best of my knowledge, never been there.
What have I missed? a Boris expose on the Croat tiddlewinks world champion? A list (of one) honest taxi driver in Dalmatia? Mambo finds good and honest civil servant in local obcina who is actually helpful and willing to work unpaid overtime in order to help Croat economy?
Totally guilty, m' Lud - or in this case, m'Lady. I have no idea what this main site is. Indeed, I don't know how I have been able to survive without it.
kesterj
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Post by boris on Aug 9, 2010 20:15:36 GMT 1
The website is a bit plain IMO, Jazz it pal (maybe even with some music!!!)
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Post by pinkfloyd on Aug 9, 2010 23:39:10 GMT 1
croatia.hr? clicked on "Business", saw "Croatia – business efficiency.." stopped reading content of that site speaks itself.. and what I mean by that is for example.. click on Cylcing under Activities croatia.hr/en-GB/Activities-and-attractions/Active-tourism/Cycling. info u get is.. From the macadam field trials ideal for mountain bikes to the asphalted roads for family sightseeing, cycling in Croatia offers huge variety of ideal trails for everyone's taste and u know people wanna useful info on that, they ask about cycling here too, and I even met one couple in my town that was travelling on bicycles.. it really surprised me to see tourists in my town ;D to sum it up, propaganda & bs, same as on Trade and Investment Promotion Agency website - Why invest in Croatia? www.apiu.hr/Home.aspx?PageID=5 :facepalm: anyway they suck a$$.. better look at Lonely Planet, and the way they operate. community segment is huge imo in this kind of business.. just look at their forum, people love to write about their experiences, whether good or bad etc. and when traveling somewhere, you look for trip reports to that place, club and hotel reviews, and so on, right, so why not "allow" people to share their experiences here, and let the community grow and develop content. lonely planet & croatia.hr are not really serious competition to u, cause this is just "niche" for lonely planet, and everything related to croatian government sucks. other similiar sites are trying to sell/rent/whatever, so they don't provide value, they take it... and that's where you can have/improve advantage and leave all similar sites (if there are any at all) miles away. also on lonely planet forum - croatia, u can see what people wanna do here(activities, business, whatever), what "problems" and questions people have with cro, offer solutions & answers and voila... traffic boom(hopefully)?
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Post by dugodude on Aug 10, 2010 7:16:39 GMT 1
So, The Croatia Tourism and Apiu sites are
"to sum it up, propaganda & bs," and "they suck a$$.."
"better look at Lonely Planet, and the way they operate. community segment is huge imo in this kind of business.. just look at their forum, people love to write about their experiences, whether good or bad etc. "
"lonely planet & croatia.hr are not really serious competition to u, cause this is just "niche" for lonely planet, and everything related to croatian government sucks. other similiar sites are trying to sell/rent/whatever, so they don't provide value, they take it... and that's where you can have/improve advantage and leave all similar sites (if there are any at all) miles away."
Er, exactly. They are also teeming with adverts, and written with advertisers in mind.
see; "Not so long ago the mention of Croatia would have drawn blank stares, tell your mother you're going to Zagreb and you'd get a look of horror. Today travel magazines are tripping over themselves to proclaim Croatia the next [insert superlative here]. Fact is, the country's status as an Adriatic playground was simply on recess during the Balkan civil war. The azure waters and countless coves of the Dalmatian Coast remain a yachtsman's dream, while medieval Zagreb and World Heritage Dubrovnik oozes romance as much as ever. Best of all, Croatia has finally shrugged off the shroud of war, restoration is well underway (if not already complete), and tourism is quickly returning. Hurry, get here before your mother thinks it's a good idea."
THIS off a Lonely Planet page advertising 8-day trips for $1,999.
Sure, the Lonely Planet site looks chic - IT IS A PROFESSIONAL SITE, d**n IT!
When will you get it into your head, PF, this is not a professional site?
And that is exactly what I, and I suspect many who visit this place, like about it.
Would you get Riki telling the awful tale of how the authorities have been messing up her attempts to establish a business - to the benefit of both her and local Croatians - on this Lonely Planet site?
Or the scores of other tales here, written by people who have long, hands-on experience, many of them, sadly, enough to put you off investing, trying to live or even visiting Croatia?
I very much doubt it - or even if they are there, you have to trawl through pages of gloss to find them.
This board may look crude, simple and hopelessly old-fashioned to you; to me it looks authentic. (I guess that may tell you something about our different value systems, eh?)
Anna only very rarely - and, I suspect, even then mainly for legal reasons - censors anything on this board. I suspect she possibly does not like some of the stuff that comes on here, but she is liberal-minded and sensible enough to know that it's better this stuff comes out than hides under the surface - not least because that way, sometimes, it may get read by people who are actually prepared to change and improve things.
If Anna wants to take up your suggestions, and go down the flashing lights, pop-ups, background sound and I don't know what road, she is of course free to do so.
But I look in here to read the content posted by genuine people who speak honestly about what they have found, good, bad and indifferent, in and relating to Croatia.
If they go, or I can't find what they are saying due to pages of sugary blah blah flashing at my face, I for one won't be looking in.
DD
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Post by pinkfloyd on Aug 10, 2010 12:00:51 GMT 1
hehh.. dunno does it even make sense to write a reply here.
q: -flashlights/popups/music bla bla etc. a: does google have any of this, and still looks modern? modern design doesn't have to come on cost of simplicity, and good aestetichs doesn't assume excessive use of fancy stuff
q: But I look in here to read the content posted by genuine people who speak honestly about what they have found, good, bad and indifferent, in and relating to Croatia. a: and what am I saying? to build a community based upon that
q: advertising on site a: well you actually can choose who to advertise, and if you have ad's that offer quality services or whatever, then both sides benefit.
q: proffesional site a: my suggestions are about improving quality of content and user experience, building a community.. so if site has all that improved, you stop visiting?
q: Would you get Riki telling the awful tale of how the authorities have been messing up her attempts to establish a business - to the benefit of both her and local Croatians - on this Lonely Planet site? a: I dunno, but I hope she writes it all over the internet. my point is to get even more people share their experience.. bad/good hotels and their services, overpriced places to avoid, good places to go, fun things to do etc.
q: This board may look crude, simple and hopelessly old-fashioned to you; to me it looks authentic. (I guess that may tell you something about our different value systems, eh?) a: love comments about value systems... "raising the bar", delivering 110%, or whatever you call it on english, is not ok obv.
and what's funny, got sooo much resistance, and I didn't even said a word about selling books, souvenirs, or some croatian products on site(dropshipping?), or anything related to profits except some rant about ads.
resistance for new ideas, and changes is something fascinating to observe. and hard to deal with.
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Post by Anna on Aug 10, 2010 17:18:16 GMT 1
pinkfloyd, so... You asked forum participants, and you got some responses...so what does that suggest that I should do with it? No, seriously, as I said before the people that come on here don't really use the main site, so maybe you're not going to get much response on that side of things. Of course the Lonely Planet site (well, its Thorn Tree Forum) is great, TripAdvisor is great...but that's mainly the content and the advice given out and yeah, like you say, the community element of it. But isn't there a community element in any forum? Or are you suggesting some other kind of community apart from a forum like...a social network, or something? Actually, you also mention something about content as well, by which I guess you mean on the main site - do you not think the content is very good? I think maybe you think I stuck this site up in 1998 and haven't touched it since, or something, but I can assure you that's not the case at all! (I've increased the number of pages - and that's really pages, not just fluff filler pages, or splitting 1 page into 3 or similar - by something like 200% over the last year or so.) BTW, the reason I asked about the croatia.hr site is because I don't think it's all that good either (sure, it looks alright) and that's an "official" site, which you would think might be the first port of call for many people researching a country. Hey, maybe you can send them some suggestions and see what they say... ;D P.S. @kester - www.visit-croatia.co.uk
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Post by crojoe on Aug 10, 2010 17:35:52 GMT 1
Wow Anna, glad you added that link, as I had no idea there was a home page. I've always just gone straight for the forum, chit-chat section. For me, I am not too interested in renting an apartment, a car, what the weather is like, but rather interested in what those that "live" in Croatia have to say about local laws, the current situation, trends, procedures and latest Croatian news. As it seems to be posts from a "foreign prospective", I can relate to it, without nationalistic rhetoric or jibber jabber from those folks who have no clue what’s going on here.
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Post by Anna on Aug 10, 2010 17:43:00 GMT 1
Ah okay, well yes, do please have a nosy round if you like! Visit Croatia is a travel site that then got its own forum (and there were a couple of forums prior to this ProBoards one), which then evolved to have other property/living in/discussion etc sections with quite a few expats, regulars and so on... (In the sense of why the content doesn't 100% overlap!) (Though if you want to know about trains in Dubrovnik, of course had back to the main site...
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Post by Anna on Aug 10, 2010 18:15:28 GMT 1
The website is a bit plain IMO, Jazz it pal (maybe even with some music!!!) Great idea boris! What would you suggest - Severina or Oliver?
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Post by happy on Aug 10, 2010 19:06:40 GMT 1
Anna,
The site is great as it is.
No need to change for change sake.
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Post by mambo on Aug 10, 2010 21:30:15 GMT 1
Severina ? . Are you planning to publish any of her videos ? . That would really spice it up ! (lol)
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Post by pinkfloyd on Aug 11, 2010 10:50:14 GMT 1
ur killing me i.e. visit-croatia.co.uk/smarttipsdates are 2006/2007 now.. when people could submit their "smart tips" easily and instantly, and for example others could rate it with those stars from 1-5, and comment them, that would be better version of that, right? then for example, also implement reviews of hotels , restaurants, nightclubs, some activities.. people will agree on something, disagree on other things, suggest alternatives or whatever.. maybe even to enable them to register as user and contact each other apart from forum. and about content 550th time.... it's ok, but for example space ship that would bring us dust from moon would be good too, but we need other things more importantly. all I'm saying is.. see forums or whatever, and you'll see some pattern. for example. www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntree/forum.jspa?forumID=15&keywordid=112topics are: -split to dubrovnik - what to see along the way -SELF GUIDED WALKING TOUR FOR DUBROVNIK, SPLIT & ZAGREB...SUGGESTIONS? -Split to Zadar . . -Sailing to Korcula From Split or Dubrovnik -Krka from Split -bus timetables(st, du) -12 days in Croatia -Dubrovnik to Cres by car -Accommodation, hobie cat-courses and windsurfing in Dubrovnik -cycling from Split to the Islands and maybe to Dubrovnik -Cheap accommodation in Dubrovnik/Split? -Late September Dubrovnik-Korcula vicinity ------ now, on first 2 pages denominator is dubrovnik&split(and probably result of your survey is similiar?).. also there is fking cycling, people wanna cycle around, maybe longer distances etc. and there's hardly anything on that look at those "real problem"questions, and does info on your website gives answer or solution to them, or questions similiar to that.. capisci??? and hell no to Severina. Marko Perković Thopmson music would skyrocket traffic and length of stay on this site.. people would listen it all day long. jk, I hate him
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Post by gmh on Aug 11, 2010 11:02:30 GMT 1
hey pinkfloyd I have an idea. You could make your own site exactly as you describe and reap the advertising rewards once you get top listing on google.
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Post by boris on Aug 11, 2010 14:24:48 GMT 1
No not Severina! My own composition: "Croatia The Best Country In The World"
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Post by mambo on Aug 11, 2010 17:55:33 GMT 1
I took a look at this 'lonely planet' site, but after ten minutes I still had not figured out how to find items on e.g. Curacao. In addition, this site took forever to load itself. It may be just me, but in a forum the most important item is information exchange and this site does that. If you want to make it even easier you could e.g. organize the site in such a way that all topics are under each other, organized to last post. And example is e.g. kroatie.startpagina.nl/prikbord/and when you click on one of the topics you get to: kroatie.startpagina.nl/prikbord/12127757/senseopads#msg-12127757When you open the topic you will see all new posts since your last visit indicated with (new). Other good part is that you can react to older posts in sequence. However, the good part of the current Croatia board forum is that you can read all the posts without having to open each and every single one of them. Another simple option is: www.spanjeforum.nl/All the topics are easy to check and since there is a time indication behind them you can see how long ago someone posted the last comment. But again I come back to my earlier statement: If a site is good and easy to navigate, loads fast (also for slow speed internet), has all the required info...............then why change it ? Change is not the goal itself.
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