grubl
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Posts: 7
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Post by grubl on Nov 30, 2012 12:23:50 GMT 1
Dear Community, let me quickly introduce myself: I'm Austrian, living in Vienna and was reading through this forum with great pleasure. Since a few months I'm searching for a small holiday apartment in the Kvarner area and it looks like (after some disappointments) I found a great object. After my (Croatian) Lawyer did the first checks it seems like that the 2002 built Apartment House (11 Apartments) and my desired Apartment is correctly registered in the Katastar and Land Registry. Only "small" issue: in the Land Registry it says that there is no "Uporabna Dozvola" (Usage Permit) filed. I found another thread in this forum about this, but I'm still not sure what this means in practical terms? Does it make sense to buy the apartment - given all other things are "clean"? Or would you rather say "stay away"? Of course I have also asked my lawyer but it seems to me she rather took the easy way out with an answer like "everything is possible".....
Thank you so much for your help! Ciao, Berni
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Post by Carol on Nov 30, 2012 15:24:38 GMT 1
stay away... sorry its not clean and not likely to ever be.
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grubl
New Member
Posts: 7
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Post by grubl on Nov 30, 2012 15:47:25 GMT 1
Hello all, and thank you for the quick answers - highly appreciated! In the meantime I got news: The application for usage permit has been filed with the municipality on 30.10.12 (I'm currently waiting on a copy of the confirmation). So it looks like there was consensus amongst the current 11 owners that the application for the usage permit should be filed. Situation seems to be a (bit) better than initially thought. But still not "super clean".... it look like the overall building was built according to plan but they "just" made 2-3 additional apartments where originally there should be a basement and attic. Thanks again for all your advice...
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Post by mh on Dec 1, 2012 8:48:47 GMT 1
It is sad the fellow international property moguls did not explain what you (once you buy, of course), you made an application for a pardon admitting the wrong doing (not your fault, but you are the owner, so technically you are in breach) and you agree to pay a fine and any associated costs as a result of the building permit breach. That can include rectification of the problem if possible. if your application is not granted, the building will be removed at your cost. Sorry, just another way to fill up our government purse. As you did not buy, ask for a discount. How much, I do not know, depends.... I think the fine alone is 75000 kn, but I am not sure.... The process is known in Croatian as 'legalizacija' and there is a due date to lodge a pardon. Beyond certain date, property is illegal. Cmon, foreign investors, you should know better, all your properties are likely illegal!
Good luck!!!! And of course - play fair, pay the tax.
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Post by gobrea on Dec 1, 2012 19:24:40 GMT 1
Hi grub, if there is the faintest smell of something wrong walk away...... I assume you visit this region for holidays, but there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE in going for holidays and actually buying a place to visit on holidays.
You can trust the majority of posters on this forum, but the local lawyers and local accountants advise I wouldnt put any blind faith in them. They just see you as a cash cow. And if you get into any difficulties well then you are on your own.
Unfortunately sad to say but this is the reality here. Oh yeah expect plenty of neighbors like the poster called MH.
Have you considered Spain or Portugal?.....countries in the EU, stablish, cheaper.
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Post by crojoe on Dec 1, 2012 20:37:01 GMT 1
Does anyone know if MH is student or child? Sure not anyone with a brain or understanding of how things work in Croatia today.
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grubl
New Member
Posts: 7
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Post by grubl on Dec 1, 2012 20:42:53 GMT 1
Gobrea, thank you for your advise. Personally I consider Croatia as I only have a 4hr drive there vs. a flight to Spain or Portugal. I'm also into boating and therefore Croatia is perfect. Of course these guys have.... let's say "different" business ethics than other countries ;-) I also did business in HR for the last seven years BUT never had anything to do with real estate. So: I take all your posts VERY seriously and appreciate all good advise. Today I was at the apartment house, again and I got a copy of the confirmation that the municipality received the apllication for a usage permit. (which I consider not very helpful) The main issue is that the original building plan consisted of 8 apartments, but the building has now 11 (3 "extra" ones instead of the attic). Well, and now its "just" a question of a risk assessment. What is the worst case scenario, and how much would it cost ;-) Tear down the building? Tear down the top floor? Just ask for a "fee" and make it "legal"? Ask for a new building plan? But I guess there is tons of buildings with the same issue and they can not tear them all down, can they?
regards, berni
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grubl
New Member
Posts: 7
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Post by grubl on Dec 1, 2012 23:10:50 GMT 1
january, will do. And I will take my time..... I will also give some of the other owners a call (2 Austrians, some Slovenians and some Croatians). They should have a big interest in getting things straight.
rgss, berni
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Post by Ribaric on Dec 2, 2012 9:51:05 GMT 1
Does anyone know if MH is student or child? Sure not anyone with a brain or understanding of how things work in Croatia today. MH's comments, style, spelling and demeanour are indistinguishable from those of a former poster who, a number of times, slowly morphed into the worst kind of nationalistic "kill the Serbs" poster. I'm not 100% sure, but very close. She is a lady in California (you can tell from her ISP) who is part of the worst section of the diaspora. Allegedly.
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Post by crojoe on Dec 2, 2012 10:11:22 GMT 1
Does anyone know if MH is student or child? Sure not anyone with a brain or understanding of how things work in Croatia today. MH's comments, style, spelling and demeanour are indistinguishable from those of a former poster who, a number of times, slowly morphed into the worst kind of nationalistic "kill the Serbs" poster. I'm not 100% sure, but very close. She is a lady in California (you can tell from her ISP) who is part of the worst section of the diaspora. Allegedly. If that is true then MH is a hypocrite, as no doubt MH would then be a foreigner in a foreign country. Just biting the hand that feeds!
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grubl
New Member
Posts: 7
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Post by grubl on Dec 2, 2012 13:21:28 GMT 1
......well, I have to say that also "MH's" post contains some advice for me. So: as long as we stay somehow on topic and nobody becomes rude - I'm happy that this is a lively forum with good advice....
rgds, berni
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Post by mh on Dec 6, 2012 15:06:57 GMT 1
MH's comments, style, spelling and demeanour are indistinguishable from those of a former poster who, a number of times, slowly morphed into the worst kind of nationalistic "kill the Serbs" poster. I'm not 100% sure, but very close. She is a lady in California (you can tell from her ISP) who is part of the worst section of the diaspora. Allegedly. If that is true then MH is a hypocrite, as no doubt MH would then be a foreigner in a foreign country. Just biting the hand that feeds! Please let me know when I become a gay. For all of you who did not know, when people in Croatia start talking behind you back you are a gay, you are on the right track. Until then, happy to help, but unlikely to make any difference.
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Post by crojoe on Dec 6, 2012 17:18:14 GMT 1
If that is true then MH is a hypocrite, as no doubt MH would then be a foreigner in a foreign country. Just biting the hand that feeds! Please let me know when I become a gay. For all of you who did not know, when people in Croatia start talking behind you back you are a gay, you are on the right track. Until then, happy to help, but unlikely to make any difference. If your happy to help then maybe figure out what your trying to say before you say it. For you to come on this site and preach your anti-foreigner retoric, slamming us foreigners, accusing us of not paying taxes, stealing homes we bought from Croats and so forth is foreigner bashing. Since (for the most part) we're all classed as foreigners in Croatia, then you can't fault us for trying to help you see the facts and straighten out some of your twisted mind-sets. No one here has called you gay, but if that makes you "happy", then each to his own. But the million Kuna question is, are you Croatian and are you living abroad?
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Post by mh on Dec 11, 2012 15:59:04 GMT 1
Joe,
There is a CHF 1M question 4 u. If you buy a new iPad, does it make you communist and murderer of the Tibetan women and children?
I stand by all my comments. Property investors (making money by banking on the credit card) are thing of the past ( pleasure is something different). No significant new folk will come, but to recycle existing housing stock. As government needs money, someone needs to pay and someone who will not riot on the streets is a good bet. This recession is a last man standing game. It is only important not to be on the line of fire. Once it is over, people are likely to forget and some new investors will come and money will roll again. Keep safe. I enjoy your opinion.
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Post by crojoe on Dec 11, 2012 16:48:00 GMT 1
Joe, There is a CHF 1M question 4 u. If you buy a new iPad, does it make you communist and murderer of the Tibetan women and children? I stand by all my comments. Property investors (making money by banking on the credit card) are thing of the past ( pleasure is something different). No significant new folk will come, but to recycle existing housing stock. As government needs money, someone needs to pay and someone who will not riot on the streets is a good bet. This recession is a last man standing game. It is only important not to be on the line of fire. Once it is over, people are likely to forget and some new investors will come and money will roll again. Keep safe. I enjoy your opinion. Don't know, as I don't have an ipad nor would I buy one at this time unless you where to buy me one for Christmas.
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