fantasy or reality?

[abbe]

I have this vague fantasy of buying a property on
the coast that has living space plus a handful of
extra rooms or apartments, or where we could build
on such a thing - you know, precisely what people
are living in and renting out all over the coast.

the fantasy goes that we would add some nice internet
access, set up some computers, and have an internet cafe',
maybe run a bit more like a bed and breakfast with
alternatives to eat croatian-style food or whatever
other cuisine I feel like scaring up that day, and maybe
even a little organic garden out back for some of the ingredients. we'd have english and croatian spoken fluently between the two of us (hopefully I'll even be a little closer to fluent in Croatian in the near future!). We'd rent out the rooms during the season, long-term or short, charge for the internet cafe, and use the internet access to do a bit of remote consulting work as well, and live there year-round - not richly, but not in massive debt and able to put food on the table.

So how much of a fantasy is this?

Clearly people who have lived there all along can
make some income off of adding on a few rooms and
renting them out - but how realistic is it if you don't yet
own any property? how much does a house with a few
rentable rooms cost, or building on these rooms in this
time frame? Are they all working other jobs and just supplementing their income?

We could, realistically, put some cash into this, but not
hundreds of thousands of euros, and we might be able
to borrow a few hundred thousand euros but then we'd
need to be making enough soon enough to be paying
that off... what scale of investment is really needed to
set something like this up, and has anyone here done it?

hvala.

[alsdoubles]

I would proceed with extreme caution. But, if you do it, do everything for cash, with nothing written down, which has risks all of its own. But, at least you have the cash. Or not, maybe.
From my experience. Nothing is easy in Croatia, for an outsider. And despite what the bleeding hearts and the 'new age' people think and say, there is NO official welcome mat out for you. If you get anywhere near to being legit, which is one monumental task in itself, then you will be a bigger target for this system's extreme taxes. From the first moment you get off the plane you will be paying taxes, legit or not legit. Croatia is okay. I live here. Thre is much to be desired here. Lived the dream. But, in reality, again from my experience only, it's just NOT what you may think. Just be careful. But if you don't do it you wont know. That's the catch, yes?

[Anja]

I knew you would pick up on this one Alsdoubles

On subject I would say it is possible but you have to enter the area cold headed, no emotions involved at all.

Then you have to have a business plan, a good one and present the plan to an accountant, in UK and in Croatia.

You need to be sure who do you target.

Maybe you target youths travellers?

Croatian food?

So much of it.. maybe something different?

But in my opinion every dream is liveable.. … you need to suffer for it.. are you ready to sacrifice?

I will tell you a story about my Croatian friend.

He has got a master degree in science.. he left his well paid job in Croatia ( in Croatia because of no many jobs on market this is like committing suicide)
But he had this dream..
I was very sceptical to hear about it.. healthy food.. nature.. etc.. it is plenty of it in Croatia..

He opened a restaurant in Brac, with his friends, in the middle of nowhere, in the middle of a vineyard..
I mentioned this before, this is it:
www.thisiscroatia.com/brac/konoba.htm
Gosh, I just sometimes compare this view with a view from my office window in the City..
But his food is great, I always knew it.. you have to do what you like doing..;D

Few months later, he is doing more than well, buses of tourists coming to eat there..

He had Croatian Televsion in last week, a program showing his restaurant will be shown this Sunday on HRT.. the whole country will see it..
I couldn't believe it.. but HE SO STRONGLY BELIVES in his dream.
And he got there..with not so much money involved

Same time, he has got so many contacts, he knows people and people know him..

For you it would be much harder, same as it would be for me..as we do not live there..

If you want to serve food than you need to be more than an excellent cook, you have to have food ideas in you little finger..you would have to be born for that.. like my friend.. are you born for that?

I wouldn’t be able to do something like that as I can not cook. ;D You understand what I mean.. ;D

It is not easy at all..

Regarding renting rooms.. 90% of people who rent rooms have full-time jobs. Renting is jus an extra. You can not live on it. Some lucky peole can, but nowadays everyone is renting, there is more apartments than tourists, this season was reported very bad.. you have to be carefull. If you need to pay the mortgage or loan from 'that money' then forget it..

[abbe]

Ok, so i'm not really asking about "how hard is it to start your
own business" but about the reality of how much money these
kinds of properties go for, vs how much you can expect to earn
through each tourist season, etc.

is it just like housing in Zagreb where if you had somewhere to live
during communism you are probably in great shape now but if you
are 30, just got married, and your parents can't split up their
apartment in half then you have to be rich to afford a place to
live? In other words, is there even anyone who has a place on
the coast now who would consider adding rooms to it and renting them out, or does the cost of building/renovating etc vs what you earn from renting out rooms just not add up? if renting out the
rooms won't even pay for the fact that a house with rooms to
rent costs that much more than a house big enough to live in,
there's kind of no point...

as the fantasy goes we would definitely not be trying to open
a restaurant - only, if we had 5 rooms to rent, charging a
premium for getting a nice breakfast and an evening meal, so
we'd be cooking for 12 instead of for 2 or something. and
offering a choice of croatian food or foreign food (I can do a fine
blitva i krumpire, bakalar, and all kinds of vegetables, but need to
work on my crni rizot and pasticada before it comes anywhere
close to my mother in law's!), and love to cook anything from
Thai, Cambodian, Tex-Mex, Indian, American South BBQ, Italian, Chinese, Japanese, hamburgers macaroni and cheese and fruit cobbler, etc etc.

So we'd be targeting, though i hate to say it, the kind of travelers who come to croatia and then get a little bored of eating perfect
grilled fish day in and day out. we could offer things like outdoor adventure guide services on the side, if things came together.
but also, I hope, we'd host people who can
appreciate the country, having hosts who can teach them
about croatian language, culture, etc. (oh, and we'd have to
grow just enough grapes to learn to make prosek, eh? :-)

we are not outsiders, exactly, either I'd be getting citizenship
and my husband grew up in Croatia - and we'll be living in
zagreb first before it happens... and do have contacts in Croatia, etc. What we do not have, though, is land we owned before
the war and thus are not deeply in debt because of!

[Guest]

Abbe
Great dream and I hope it works out for you both. Wish I was young enough to start something like that myself.

Just one thing to remember ......... the season in Croatia is fairly short. Late June to mid September at best.
Good luck
TL