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Post by crojoe on Dec 21, 2011 19:14:08 GMT 1
Croatian Times reports a possible rise in pdv from 23% to 25%. What is with the new government? Ever heard of cutting the fat? Looks like another group of leachs out to tax the people and working class to the hilt while they (the Gov.) continue on as always, no cuts to their spending, wages and benifits. A Sad day for the poor man! Loads of big firms in Croatia owe loads of taxes but don't pay.
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Post by justapixel on Dec 21, 2011 20:23:55 GMT 1
In order to keep Croatian debt rating from going into trash territory, they have to reduce budget deficit by 9 billion kunas. Quickly. By raising PDV to 25%, they will be able to gain 3 billion kn without much fuss. I don't see raising PDV as a problem itself, but if they intend to base their future policies on raising the taxes and avoid cutting the expenses and introducing deeper reforms, then we have a much, much bigger problem than a 100-200 kn/mo extra tax.
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Post by Ribaric on Dec 21, 2011 21:07:38 GMT 1
For a country like Croatia where income tax collection is sporadic at best, pdv will at least target the spenders (therefore the "haves") and increase the exchequer. One of the options the Greeks wanted to try was to replace all income tax (the Greeks are masters at not paying it) with a value added tax. Sadly, EU harmonisation prevents it which is probably the case here now.
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Post by crojoe on Dec 21, 2011 21:20:24 GMT 1
Sure would be nice if instead of the Gov. talking about raising taxes, instead they could be sitting down with their budget and seeing what they can cut, demand big companies pay their taxes, foreclose on all bankrupt companies and sell their assets as needed, sell more governmental properties, stop the purchase of private luxury items with company money (boats and expensive cars for each member of the bosses family).
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Post by mambo on Dec 22, 2011 3:12:04 GMT 1
They could find the 9 billion in roughly 2 hours.
Simply stop the plundering and waste of tax payers money and the problem is solved.
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Post by justapixel on Dec 22, 2011 9:59:57 GMT 1
They could find the 9 billion in roughly 2 hours. Simply stop the plundering and waste of tax payers money and the problem is solved. Not really. Identifying plundering and waste is a slow and painful process which takes years. Most of the waste goes into subventions, which amount around 6 bil, but even reducing the subventions to zero (huge social backlash), would not be enough. They will have to cut the expenses (health system, public service salaries, pensions) by 5-20% all over the board to reach required target. If we're lucky, then come the reforms, monitoring and gradual reduction of corruption and waste. . |
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Post by ray51 on Dec 22, 2011 12:55:53 GMT 1
IMHO , the high PDV rates are unfair , as they hurt the poorest in the society most !
Because they tend to ( have to = need to ) spend all of their income , or more than that ;
whereas the richer ones can choose how much to spend and where and still have other reserves which therefore remain untaxed by PDV ( seeing as you don't yet have proper mechanisms in place for taxation of bank interest , dividends , annuities or CGT ) .
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Post by justapixel on Dec 22, 2011 13:25:56 GMT 1
IMHO , the high PDV rates are unfair , as they hurt the poorest in the society most ! Because they tend to ( have to = need to ) spend all of their income , or more than that ; whereas the richer ones can choose how much to spend and where and still have other reserves which therefore remain untaxed by PDV ( seeing as you don't yet have proper mechanisms in place for taxation of bank interest , dividends , annuities or CGT ) . The only tax that may hurt the rich is property tax. It will take ages to get introduced, and the rich will constantly be finding loopholes to avoid it. PDV is the most democratic tax - it taxes everybody the same way, proportionally to what they spend. And it's hardest to avoid, so it doesn't reward cheaters. Taxing bank interests and dividends generally hurts investments, and avoiding investors is not a very smart thing to do. . |
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Post by Carol on Dec 22, 2011 15:22:50 GMT 1
the more PDV increases, the better for the black economy.
Its not a simple calculation for the government (even if they think it is) because we all know tax evasion is rife in Croatia and the higher the taxes, the greater the incentive to evade taxes.
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Post by justapixel on Dec 22, 2011 16:07:58 GMT 1
the more PDV increases, the better for the black economy. Its not a simple calculation for the government (even if they think it is) because we all know tax evasion is rife in Croatia and the higher the taxes, the greater the incentive to evade taxes. Most businesses go through PDV system and even the ones avoiding PDV still have to buy their resources with PDV. The only "black economy" encounter I can recall in last two years was using non official car repairman, and even there, there was a written bill and probably PDV was actually paid. The real taxes that black economy practitioners avoid are income taxes, which are much higher than measly 23%. I know many people who earn much more than it's visible in their tax report. . |
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Post by Carol on Dec 22, 2011 19:08:07 GMT 1
building work/ building materials/ any kind of services / purchases from local food producers
I think we are talking capital city versus countryside experiences
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Post by Ribaric on Dec 22, 2011 22:05:20 GMT 1
I always defer to your financial nouse Carol but (you knew there a "but" coming). If pdv is scrapped on all services where it has proven difficult to collect then all service providers will be on a level playing field and hence a huge reduction in the black economy. I realise you'd have to up the rate on everything else and this would encourage smuggling on an epic scale .... p'raps I should shaddup now.....
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