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Post by joeceltzaslobodu on Aug 23, 2013 2:34:37 GMT 1
Its 20 yrs since I was in Bosnia and those times were not good . But recently Iv thought a lot of the events,tragedies ,atrocities etc inflicted through war. I wonder how Bosnian Croats and Croatians feel about being separated. Do you feel as a different people or hope to be united as one some day. We Irish Catholics in Northern Ireland are similar to Bosnian Croats and our histories of being oppressed through centuries also similar. Za Slobodu Hrvatskih prijatelja
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Post by crojoe on Aug 23, 2013 8:32:00 GMT 1
Its 20 yrs since I was in Bosnia and those times were not good . But recently Iv thought a lot of the events,tragedies ,atrocities etc inflicted through war. I wonder how Bosnian Croats and Croatians feel about being separated. Do you feel as a different people or hope to be united as one some day. We Irish Catholics in Northern Ireland are similar to Bosnian Croats and our histories of being oppressed through centuries also similar. Za Slobodu Hrvatskih prijatelja Under the EU they might become one, but not on their own. To much water under the bridge. Of course that does not stop commerce which goes right on despite war, feelings, racial tensions, war crimes and so forth. Also, the real criminals of the war will never really see justice (like in most countries / even the UK, USA and others). In some ways with Croatia recently joining the EU this has created another barrier between Bosnia and Serbia. It's had a knock on effect. The younger generation have no concept of the war, so they are pretty open to embarrassing many peoples from former Yugo, but the older generation who actually fought, bled, saw loved ones die still hold those feelings. The sad thing is those that did fight are now forgotten hero's on all sides, a generation many people want to forget, especially the powers that be (unless an election is upcoming).
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Post by quest on Aug 23, 2013 13:14:59 GMT 1
Its 20 yrs since I was in Bosnia and those times were not good . But recently Iv thought a lot of the events,tragedies ,atrocities etc inflicted through war. I wonder how Bosnian Croats and Croatians feel about being separated. Do you feel as a different people or hope to be united as one some day. We Irish Catholics in Northern Ireland are similar to Bosnian Croats and our histories of being oppressed through centuries also similar. Za Slobodu Hrvatskih prijatelja Of course we are the same people, and it's the same with the Serbs in Bosnia and Serbia. Bosnian muslims would like both of them out but don't have the means to do it so you get Bosnia the country as it is today, set to rotten away while the three groups search for something in common which isn't much. Just like with Yugoslavia it will fall apart when its people get to choose their future themselves.
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Post by joeceltzaslobodu on Aug 24, 2013 23:33:56 GMT 1
It good to hear your the same people, as when hostilities finish in most places, loyalties are forgotten,betrayed etc. This happens so as to avoid another conflict. Political games are played and present injustices like war criminals are free.All those who fought and suffered in any war are soon forgotten. I had Croatian friends in Bosnia/Herzegovina 20 yrs ago and recently received a few photos from another source.It got me thinking and wondering how all has turned out. Im not qualified enough on your Political situation but I never could see how Serbs, Muslims and Croats could work. War destroys trust like here in Northern Ireland. From my memories and experience in Bosnia I could never see all 3 groups becoming one.I maybe wrong as things could have changed over 20 yrs. With Croatia joining the EU,it may help regain part of Croatian Ethnic Bosnia. Its good to see Croatia in the EU .
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Post by joeceltzaslobodu on Aug 24, 2013 23:35:14 GMT 1
Its 20 yrs since I was in Bosnia and those times were not good . But recently Iv thought a lot of the events,tragedies ,atrocities etc inflicted through war. I wonder how Bosnian Croats and Croatians feel about being separated. Do you feel as a different people or hope to be united as one some day. We Irish Catholics in Northern Ireland are similar to Bosnian Croats and our histories of being oppressed through centuries also similar. Za Slobodu Hrvatskih prijatelja Under the EU they might become one, but not on their own. To much water under the bridge. Of course that does not stop commerce which goes right on despite war, feelings, racial tensions, war crimes and so forth. Also, the real criminals of the war will never really see justice (like in most countries / even the UK, USA and others). In some ways with Croatia recently joining the EU this has created another barrier between Bosnia and Serbia. It's had a knock on effect. The younger generation have no concept of the war, so they are pretty open to embarrassing many peoples from former Yugo, but the older generation who actually fought, bled, saw loved ones die still hold those feelings. The sad thing is those that did fight are now forgotten hero's on all sides, a generation many people want to forget, especially the powers that be (unless an election is upcoming).
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Post by dugodude on Aug 31, 2013 12:20:36 GMT 1
Quest wrote:
"Of course we are the same people, and it's the same with the Serbs in Bosnia and Serbia."
You seem supremely confident of that. You may be right with regard to the Croats - I don't really have any experience either way, but I wonder, especially given what I read (including in here) on local Croat attitudes to Croatian exiles from, eg Australia.
And you certainly quote a dodgy example when it comes to the Serbs.
It's always easy, or so it seems, to be at one with your kin when they are far away. Once they get up close there are, IMX, countless examples where they don't seem quite so "kinny" after all.
And in the case of the RS Serbs and Serbs "proper", I can tell you that in Novi Sad the influx of refugee Serbs from Bosnia has not gone down too well amongst many of the local Serbs, as they have testified to me. The RS Serbs are, well, let's just say "finding it difficult to integrate" with the locals' norms and culture.
"Bosnian muslims would like both of them out"
Oh, so it's just the Bosnyaks that are the problem is it?
Funny, I thought it was Serbian artillery from the surrounding hills trained on places like Sarajevo and Travnik in the early 90s. And the message that came with the exploding shells certainly was not "We love you Bosnyaks" was it?
I also seem to remember there were many vicious incidents where Bosnian Croats - once they were well armed and sure to win tactical battles - turning on their supposed Bosnyak allies after the Serbian threat had gone away.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Bosnyaks are a collection of angels - but to write "Bosnian muslims would like both of them out" when in fact there are many on all sides that want that very same thing - and bloody historical evidence to prove this - is rahter tilting the analysis, don't you think?
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